May 21, 2007 - 7:32am
I was wondering how hydrocodone compares to tramadol and if tramadol is an opiate or a synthetic opiate and if it has the potential for abuse. Ive been kicken opiates for a couple weeks and I found it, in my girls room who is also trying to kick so I was wondering if it can be abused or if its not that bad, I think shes trying to use it to wean down, not like hydro can even help our pain so im sure tramadol coulndt really do any thing to her anyway or could it? but you cant really blame b/c of the pain that comes with kicking pills.
so really just curious about the underlined part?
May 21, 2007 - 11:30am
#2
Tramadol is very weka in
Tramadol is very weak in comparison to hydrocodone. Also, it is "supposedly" not addictive. But that has been said for a lot of things in the past.
May 21, 2007 - 1:45pm
#3
WD's and pain
Yes you are correct about the stronger meds im getting off I started with being prescribed vicodin then norco and then IR oxy for my back pain and then it got out of hand (regretfuly) recreationaly from there. but let me tell you there is a lot of pain involved in withdrawls espeacily going cold turkey when you actually need the meds anyway just not an excessive amount but just enough for the pain, but im sick of the whole discusting cycle of addiction anyway. But beleive me withdrawl symptoms hurt bad, probably more than what I got the meds prescribed for originally, really the and WD's are the biggest reasons people have to do opiats every day, they want to get high yes but WD are strait agony, you want to die, they x*#& stay away from opiates anyone who reads this and everyone in general please, youll be doing yourself a huge favor. Unless you really need them take them then and wean off addiction comes fast and before you know it you NEED it. to the person im replying to I know that you meant to have distinction between pain and the opiates there associated with but there is pain in WD's.
May 21, 2007 - 3:13pm
#4
I'm sorry if you took what I
I'm sorry if you took what I said the wrong way, I didn't mean you don't feel pain, but that having no pills doesn't cause pain, it causes withdraw- the withdraw symptoms are what causes the pain you are feeling. I hope I explained that right. I'm just trying to make a difference between pain generated from a specific problem, and the feeling of pains you get when going through withdraw.
believe me, I know ALL about it. I have been prescribed 6 10/325 norco a day (#180/month), now I am about to start 11/day, or #330/month. It's a curse and blessing all in the same thing. I hate having to take them and need them, however, I would be in terrible pain w/out- not from the w/draws but from what it is given to me for-my actual injury.
I wasn't trying to say in the least that its easy to go through w/draw, or to lessen what you are going through. it takes alot to get off, especially going cold turkey- I couldn't even do that!
I'm a social worker, not a medical professional. All comments and thoughts are simply my opinion and experience.
May 26, 2007 - 8:25pm
#5
Have you spoken to your
Have you spoken to your doctor about changing to a long-acting narcotic rather than Norco?
May 27, 2007 - 2:48pm
#6
Yeah, we tried a few
Yeah, we tried a few extended release meds last year with no avail: first we started with oxy ER 20mg-it didnt help, then 40mg-no help, then MS Contin 15mg-no help, then dbled it-helped a little, so given the 30mg-no help.
By then my doc said if these strong ER meds aren't working then the only thing we can do is just keep you on the only thing that does work-hydrocodone.First it was 5/500, then 7.5/500, then 2x 5/500, then 10/500, then 10/325, now I have gone from 2x-3x.
When 6/day wasn't working the doc said he didn't know what to do since the other meds didn't work, so all we could do it db my dose w/out hitting the 4000mg/day rule. I know I am still at risk for liver problems, but I like I have said before, it is a choice of which is the lesser of two evils? Either I take the meds and risk liver problems, or I don't and stay in constant debilitating pain. I wouldn't be able to do much with the pain- I couldn't clean the house, do my homework, play with my son, etc- so I must choose chancing my liver to maintain a somewhat regular life.
I'm a social worker, not a medical professional. All comments and thoughts are simply my opinion and experience.
May 27, 2007 - 11:07pm
#7
Finally I found something that works!!
Okay, I am so excited about this I had to share it w/ all of you guys and gals. After 2 total car accidents and a grueling job I have been living in constant pain. If I had a good day I would write it in the calendar.
I asked Dr to put me on Cymbalta. I swear I can't live without this stuff now!! For years I could hardly do the dishes or clean my bathtub and some days I just couldn't. I have chomped on pretty much everything over the past 15 years. Zero luck with Ultram. I am very familiar with Norco,Soma,Flexaril,etc etc.. I have never felt relief like this Cymbalta has brought me I hope it can work for everyone like it has worked for me. I was literally at the end of my rope. It takes several weeks for it to work I just wish I had started it sooner. One drawback for me is that it contributes to my insomnia. So thank God for Ambien too. Oh yeah,it won't get you high. I am high on the fact I am out of pain for now and feel like this stuff is a total blessing and that for me not to share my experience would be selfish. I know I must sound like an idiot but I want to shout it from the roof top instead of laying on the floor on an icepack! Good luck yall!
T
May 28, 2007 - 2:02am
#8
I am happy you found
I am happy you found something to work for you, but I have a few questions...
When you said you couldn't do things- is that b/c of depression/anxiety, or from pain? I ask this b/c you said you had experience w/ a pain med, muscle relaxers, and now a depression med. I understand though that some meds have alternative uses, such as cymbalta.
"Cymbalta is approved by the FDA for the treatment of major depressive disorder, as well as for the management of diabetic peripheral neuropathic pain (DPNP). If offers relief from both the emotional and painful physical symptoms associated with depression." www.cymbalta.com
I don't mean to contradict you, or question you, I was just curious.Like I said I am happy for you that you were able to find something that could help you with your problems-it takes alot to finally find that one certain thing-and its great that you were able to!
I'm a social worker, not a medical professional. All comments and thoughts are simply my opinion and experience.
May 28, 2007 - 2:49am
#9
personally tramadol
personally tramadol (ultram) helps me with withdrawl from 10/325 norcos, some people say its psychological, i say anything to help as long as you research and do it "safely"
I AM NOT A MEDICAL DOCTOR OR PHARMACIST. THIS IS MY OPINION ONLY, THANKS!
~just a little bit...
May 28, 2007 - 3:24pm
#10
Cymbalta
Dear JS,
I totallad 2 cars, the first 15 years ago the second in 1997. Consequently I also totalled my neck. My job only exaserbates my condition to the point that I sometimes cannot complete my day. To answer your question first I have the pain from my disc trouble and chronic muscleoskeltal pain. Dr also said I have fibromyalgia as a result from all that trauma caused in the accidents. We believe that my depression is caused by my physical pain, as it has literally stolen my life. Since being on the Cymbalta I have recently been brought relief from my physical pain. I still have my pain med and muscle relaxor Rx and also my sleeping pill. I am taking less of that, alot less because I was taking too much of it over the last 5 years in a desperate attempt to get relief. I was really going out of my mind, angry and sad and frustrated because my neck and back pain kept me from doing anything and being grouchy all the time. I also lived on a TENS unit and massage therapy, Biofreeze and every other sort of cream and potion. Including Lidoderm patches. I am SO greatful for this relief and I know I am a happier person to be around. Ask my hubby, I am not laying on icepacks and slathering Biofreeze on myself all the time. Although I am not in perfect shape I feel alot better. I hope it will continue to work and I wanted to share with others. Did I mention that it does keep me up and I always had a problem with insomnia so this I will just have to accept because I feel too good to stop taking it. Also I was on Zoloft a few years ago for about 6 months to help me get thru a rough patch (a death) and My physical pain was not affected by that drug, it only helped me to stop crying. I hope that answered your question. Thanks for caring.
Trollop
May 28, 2007 - 9:42pm
#11
Tramadol is a synthetic
Tramadol is a synthetic narcotic that not only has effects on opoid receptors but also serotonin, adrenal glands, and GABA. So its acts like a narcotic and a anti-depressant which some doctors use it for off label. Its roughly equal potent to codeine.Stoping tramadol cold turkey can cause some serious withdrawal symptoms similar to Benzodiazepine withdrawals. I am not totally sure but I also thought that it is a partial antagonist of the opoid receptors, and if so would result in worse withdrawal symptoms if taken while and full opiod agonist such as morphine, codeine, hydros, oxycodone, etc. was still in the system.
May 28, 2007 - 10:39pm
#12
To the best of my knowledge,
To the best of my knowledge, tramadol does not contain anything in it that may cause withdrawal symptoms to occur in opiate tolerant patients. The package insert does make mention of the fact that, when discontinued abruptly, the patient may experience withdrawal symptoms.
The package insert also makes reference to the fact that introducing this drug to someone with a history of opiate abuse may re-initiate the addiction. See The package insert on Ultramtm at the link provided.
Gtrplayer
May 29, 2007 - 10:37am
#13
hi sleeper, be careful with
hi sleeper, be careful with the tramadol, if you over do it trying to satisfy your craving for the hydros or stronger meds, you could really over do it. I have. It dose help but i found myself almost replacing my addicton with tramadol!
I still take one tramadol in the morning, and Im not a pain suffer, I just abused hydro for the high feeling. its been several months since last october that I quit hydros. Its almost a thing for me, to have 2 take a pill in the morning to get going, its a habit I have, taking a pill to say okay I took a pill, im allright for the day. Like how they say herion addicts like the process of shooting up as much as the drug.
I hope this helps, and have a wonderful day.
Pill_Head
May 29, 2007 - 5:15pm
#14
Im not saying that they
Im not saying that they add something extra into it. I was under the impression that Tramadol HCL was itself a partial opiate antagonist. Im sure you know what an opioid receptor antagonist is, and if Tramadol was one and used as a detox drug from Hydrocodone faster onset and more intense withdrawal syptoms would occur.
(edited by TeamPharmer)
May 30, 2007 - 8:53am
#15
Sorry, solo5010, tramadol
Sorry, solo5010, tramadol does not have any antagonistic properties or ingredients in it. To be honest, I'm not sure what you are asking anymore.
I'll just answer your questions in order.
I do know what an opiate antagonist is.
Tramadol is not an opiate antagonist, it is just tramadol.
Tramadol is not designed to be a drug used to wean people off of other opiates, regardless of what other boards, or this board even might say.
Tramadol will not increase the withdrawal intensity, it may however; prolong the withdrawal phase since tramadol is in and of itself, an atypical opioid. There is no significant CNS depression associated tramadol.
There is a difference between "precipitated" and "re-initiated". If a drug states that it may "precipitate withdrawal symptoms", it means that the drug might induce/cause withdrawal symptoms. Such as the warning on drugs like Talacen. If a label says it may re-initiate the addiction, it means that this drug may cause a patient to start the same drug misuse, abuse cycle.
Short answer, tramadol will do nothing to cause withdrawal to be "worse". I'm a little hesitant to even post that, due to the fact I'm starting to second gess the intent of this question.
Gtrplayer
May 30, 2007 - 1:13pm
#16
I know my original post
I know my original post was edited for good reason, I made a statement that was of bad judgement. Also I wasnt really asking any questions in my previous posts. I was simply making an uneducated statement about Tramadol HCL "that I was under the impression, that Tramadol is a partial opioid receptor antagonist", kinda like how Buprenorphine is not a full opioid agonist. I didnt mean to imply that there are extra drugs added to Tramadol containing products. I completely understand what you said in your post and I now know that Tramadol HCL is not an antagonist.
try this, its another post we just had discussing tramadol strength and comparisons. I've heard of other people using ultram in addition to other things during their recovery, such as immodium.
what do you mean "not like hydro can even help our pain"? I'm taking it that you were taking a much stronger opiate than hydro and you are now in recovery from the addiction, correct?
No offense, just to be clear, its not really pain from kicking pills, but withdraw symptoms.
www.pharmer.org/node/6923
I'm a social worker, not a medical professional. All comments and thoughts are simply my opinion and experience.