I'm sorry to keep bother you guys for advice, but I really do appreciate all the advice posters give me here. And I apologize in advance for the length of this post....
OK, about one week ago my back was in complete agony and my tramadol was doing absolutely nothing for the pain, it was so bad that I ended up in the emergency room. I wasn't sure if I messed up a disc or if it was just muscle spasms or what. All they could do was give me some vicodin to hold me over till I could get in touch with my primary care doc the next day.
The following day I call up my primary care doc and explained to one of his recpitionists what had happend and what I was told to do by the ER staff (the ER doc told me he couldn't give me a prescription due to ER policy but he advised me to talk to my doc first thing the following day) she asked several questions about it in a very smug, accusational (is that a word?) tone, questioning whether I was really in pain or not and then she finally said "well it's up to doctor kosco, I really don't know if he'll be able to do anything for you"... I waited around for a call back from his office, called the pharmacy a couple times.... nothing, I was blown off completely.
The next day I call his office again, explain my situation again to a different receptionist. She seemed friendly and understanding and she ends the conversation with "Well, I'll pass a note along to the doctor, you should have something by this afternoon". A couple hours later I get a call "we have a prescription for percocet you can pick up before the office closes".... finally. He gives me just enough (30) to hold me over until my appt with my orthopedic doc.
Now, a week later, I just went to my orthopedic doc to go over my MRI results, one of my discs has deteriorated about half-way and it's rubbing against nerves while my scoliosis makes things even more uncomfortable and all that wonderful stuff. I ask him about what I can do from here and he goes into details about pain management clinics and getting shots which I'm more than willing to do since I hear the epidural shots work really well, but that won't be for a few more weeks so I ask him what should I do until then as far as pain medication goes (since I was close to empty on my percocet). He tells me to give my primary care doc a call. Alright no big deal....
So I get home, call up my primary care doc, speak with a receptionist. I tell her about the MRI results and that my orthopedic doc told me to call my primary care doc for medication. And I wasn't sure if my doc wanted to keep going with the percs, or try vicodin, or what. Again, this lady was being very rude and more or less interrogating me the whole time, my favorite part was: "What? You have a degenerated disc?" (in a rather "thats not possible, your a liar" tone). This time the closer is "I don't know, I'll see what he says" Then roughly 2 minutes or less later I get a call back saying "You just received 30 percocet a week ago, he can't do a refill on this, it's way too soon. Try calling back sometime next week"
Where I have the issue is that he gave me 30 perc's exactly 7 days prior to the call with the directions "take one tablet every 6 hours".... Now, every 6 hours would mean 4 a day, 30 divided by four comes out to 7.5 days. Sure I had a couple left at the time, but I figured I'd get the call out of the way now so I wouldn't have to rush to get it done on friday (esp since percocet can't be called in to the pharmacy) and it had been 7 days. Also, I can't imagine there was anyway in ???$* she actually ran this by my doctor since she called back within 2 minutes. And she specifically said call back next week (meaning monday at the earliest).
Am I missing something here?
I'm getting really tired of everyone in the medical community treating me a drug addict because of my age despite the fact I have 6 years of documented pain, x-rays, and MRI's all showing problems in my spine. What do I have to do to prove I'm in pain all the time?
I apologize for the lengthy post but I really have no idea what to do here, my tramadol pretty much worthless and I can barely drag myself into work. I won't be able to get into pain management for a couple more weeks and I just don't know what to do I have an appt with my primary care doc on april 19th but that seems so far away.
Any advice or comments would be greatly appreciated...
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Tuna
(edited by TeamPharmer)
I don't know what to tell you Tuna. A lot of docs who prescribe a regular acting narcotic assume that the patient is going to take it as needed, and sleep sometime. Even though it's not fair, I can kind of see what the doctor is saying if the prescription read to take it every X amount of hours as needed, as opposed to four times per day. However, I hope that your pain management appointment goes well.
As for age playing a role in your pain management, it shouldn't, but it might. I'm relatively young, and have gone the route of physical therapy, both at home and in office, occupational therapy, a TENS unit, Epidural Injections, Nerve blocks, and medications.
Depending on your doctor's point of view, he/she may not prescribe anything until you give physical therapy a try.
Gtrplayer
Thanks for sharing your comments/thoughts lvcein and gtrplayer....I was completely out of perc's today, and my tramadol is still useless (no surprise there) and my sciatica and back were driving me to the point of insanity so I ended up calling my doc's office to see if he had some kind of answering service and somehow I ended up getting connected to him right away (yay). I told him about my MRI results and that I was a in alot of agony, then he told me that he himself had thought the script for the 30 percs was from earlier in the week, I explained it was in fact for last week and the 7 day script had only lasted 8 days. He said he'd be able to write another on monday since he can't call in perc's (maybe he didnt want to call in any hydro's because he wanted to double check to see if I was being truthful about the date, but maybe i'm just jumping to conclusions) and I agreed to tough it out till then.
I just need to try and relax, but it's hard to do that when your in loads of pain as I'm sure most of you know. Again, thanks for the comments/thoughts on the subject.
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Tuna
Dude, you need a new doc. The staff where I go is pleasant,ready to assist(accommodating me a day or two late or early) and professional, as is my MD. He actually takes the time to put his hands on me and give a physical exam!
Also, I would almost guarantee your bottle says "as needed" somewhere, so the md's staff would say "you're not supposed to take those around the clock. They are very habit forming and doctor doesn't like to write for them".
Controls are very rarely given as a frequency med, such as bid(twice a day) or qid(4 times a day). They are PRN, which means "as needed".
On their side of the coin (all stories have 3 sides:your side, their side and then the truth!), the government and DEA are watching closer than ever. Years of experience and "grapevine" info brought me to mine. If I knew ur area, perhaps I could suggest, but I won't do that.
Hope this helps, I worked in 3 hospitals and know the inner workings of all things medical. Let me know if you need any more info or anything specific.
Doc
I AM NOT A DOCTOR OR PHARMACIST. I HAVE GAINED MY KNOWLEDGE THRU EXPERIENCE AND/OR RESEARCH.
If I'm not supposed to take it around the clock then somebody (him or his staff) should have said not to, and they shouldn't put take every 6 hours on the bottle. Also, in the past my doc has told me not to miss doses on my tramadol.
But I do still like my doctor, not so much his staff. So far he's been very helpful for most of my problems and he'll he was actually taking a call at 8:00pm on a saturday.
I've recently learned of a couple "prescribe anything" docs in my area but I hear other than that, they aren't really good doctors. If it comes to it I'll see them but my regular doc should understand my situation.
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Tuna
That's the problem with the doc not actually seeing you. Had the doctor who Rx'd the Percocet seen you, he/she would have given you specific instructions on the medications. I know that in a pain management clinic, when a patient doesn't want to go on an Extended Release medication, they will stress to take the tablets X amount of times per day, so as not to get behind the pain, since you are essentially taking breakthrough pain medicine as around the clock therapy. That being said, doctors still have to assume that, even with a script written to take 1 tablet every 6 hours, a patient will, at some point, sleep. So, while the math is correct that 30 tablets would run out at 7.5 days, it still might look a little odd that the medication request came so soon. I also imagine that your doctor might have been assuming that one tablet would actually last longer than 6 hours if you've never had anything stronger than tramadol.
Best advice is to get in to see a pain specialist. I'm surprised that the doctor took the call on a Saturday, as most doctors offices state to only use the emergency access number in the event of a true emergency. I know that some pain management clinic phone messages say specifically, "Pain is not an emergency, however; if you feel that your pain is excruciating, please go to the nearest emergency room". I think they typically reserve the phone answering system for emergencies such as drug interactions, or very unpleasant side effects and the patient doesn't know whether or not he/she should go to the ER, or if it's just a side effect of the medication and wants to check with the Dr. first.
Gtrplayer
My PM doc specifies times to take meds on the bottle, even when your supposed to be asleep. For example say the med is six times per day he specifies 1@ 12pm, 1@ 4pm, 1@ 8pm,1@ 12 am 12 4 AM ECT. IT ACTUALLY SAYS THAT ON THE BOTTLE OF ALL MY MEDS. I bet the pharmacist does not like that, but he expects you to follow directions to the T...
--MUDEBONE--
He expects you to wake up in the middle of the night just to take pain medication? I would ask why he doesn't prescribe a 12 hour medication to get you through the night with your sleep unimpeded. That's borderline ridiculous, in my opinion.
Gtrplayer
It sounds like the physician was going from memory and didn't remember when he had actually called them in...Yes he could have looked that up.
I also think you need a good compassionate physician.
I'm curious as to why you didn't make an appointment with your doctor, so you could get face to face and discuss the MRI and Medicines. Someone else said something about Tramadol...That was a pretty big jump from Tramadol usually a doc would hace put you on Hydrocodone first (Vicodin,Lortab,Lorcet), which is sythentic codeine. Next up the ladder would have been your Oxycodone (synthetic Morphine) Percocet,Oxycontin,Oxy IR, but if your MRI did show a herniated disc, or something to that effect with nerve encrochment and Surgery was not an option then a plan for pain management would have been no problem with most doctors, but working in the medical field as I do there are some doctors that will let ALL suffer no matter what..., but it sounds like your doctor cares despite the snotty receptionist, but when you called Friday to get something you should have been making an appt. as soon as possible....Don't go jumping from doc to doc and ERs this will look like you have a drug problem..And as far as the Every 6hrs prn, (prn-as needed), or 6hrs just take them when you need them...If its that bad that you have to take percocet every six hrs then your doc is probably going to put you on a long acting medicine like Oxycontin and a Short acting like percocet for Breakthrough pain...Hope things get better.....YMMV
Thank you for your thoughts, however I do have an appt with my doctor this thursday the 19th, thats the soonest I could get in for a real appt. I don't jump from doctor to doctor, I just keep badgering the same doctor over and over ;D I am happy with him compared to doc's I've had in the past since he doesn't just start tapping his watch when you start talking to him, but as you said it's just his staff that can be troublesome. As to why he didn't put me on hydrocodone first I do not know, I wondered the same thing myself but thats fine with me since I prefer oxy over hydro.
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Tuna
ok, so, u have all those back problems and your only on percocet? i bet anything if u were to switch to an actual pain management dr that they would give u something for long term pain, and one for breakthrough pain. u really should give it a try since this dr. doesn't seem to even care. myself as well as my mother have been seeing the same doc and she is wonderful. she is a pain management dr and is awesome. if all else fails, try it! u never know, it might work and u wont have to worry anymore. how nice would that be?
I had my arm severed off. I was in a Coma the whole 9. This was many years ago. the Arm was saved and put back on but with not much luck. I suffer from great horrific nerve pain, (many nerve grafts)...It took me many years to finally get help. I am on 80mg of brand name OXY QID 4 a day. I finally get some relief, but that is still not enough but where do you go, how do you get more etc. without looking like an addict. My Doc. is pretty helpful but made me start @ percs then 20 40 oxy 2 a day than three a day to finally I am where I am now. the whole game stinks just prescribe heavy duty pain meds to clear cut patients and let us live a half normal life. And I am almost 40.
I totally relate Tuna. I had an appointment with my doc 2 months in advance and the day before ,at 4:45, the receptionist lady calls me to say it's cancelled and come back in 8 days. I'm out of meds and tell her to get the doc to call in a refill as soon as possible. I'm very polite because I know how she is- she acts like she is guarding God's office. Long story shiort...she strung me along for 4 days. At one point, she said "how do we know, you might be abusing these drugs." The crazy thing isthat I have been a patient of his for 8 years and she treasts me like a scuzz. I hate to say this, but I'm more educated than she is and..well...make more $$ than she does (I know, money isn't the point, but she gets me wound up).
I pay $110 dollars for visits that average 8-10 minutes. You'd think I'd get a little better treatment.
Sorry for the rant.
Best to all
CairoKid.
"We have met the enemy and he is us"
Where do you go? Are you on neurontin or lyrica, elavil or cymbalta, are you using the lidoderm patch? Have you tried nerve blocks? Switching to another narcotic once you have developed tolerance my also help. Technically their is no ceiling on the effect of narcotic agonists.
I think everyone is afraid of looking like an addict, even if they have severe pain, and an actual reason for needing strong narcotics. I started like everyone else on 5mg vics, then having to take twice the amount. after a long time my doc tried to put me on extended release oxy 20, then 40 w/ no help. he switched it to MScontin 15mg, then doubled it and that finally started to help. so of course he gave me the 30mg pills and it didn't help anymore. we finally just decided to stick w/ vics. last year I was given 10mg 10/500. after a couple months I had to start taking 2x for it to help. now I have the 10/325, other than that its the same script as a year ago, and I'm afraid even now to tell my doc it's not working. cause what can he do, give me 3 at a time? no
I'm a social worker, not a medical professional. All comments and thoughts are simply my opinion and experience.





I know just what you mean, I had lung surgery back in june of last year, removed a part of the lung and now I've got tons of documentation through several clinics, etc and cat scans showing that I've got scar tissue around and on the lung -- yet each time, they make me feel like a druggie. I've tried the shots and nerve blocks and yet it still hurts like ???$* to breathe. They've uped my dose of lyrica which has started to work, but only about as much as a 5mg perc. I've been asking for something stronger and he won't even consider it. Being 19 & in chronic pain x*#&s.
Good Luck