Prescription Opiods, Do they effect overall health and or life expectancy

Posts: 93
Joined: 2007-12-16

The title asked the question. Of Course I am not asking has your PAIN and way of life improved I already know the asnswer to that for most. In detail I mean if taken as prescribed and containing no Tylenol do the medication that we (most) of us are Dependant on to live normaly or somewhat, damage our organs or whole body in general. If so does that in turn short our overall lifespan:take years of of my life due to taking the medications. I have always wondered this since my pain had become chronic but have never read a sound answer proving so. This causes me to ponder for house on occasion.

 

Thanks Kenny 





Posts: 93
Joined: 2007-12-16
The OP had some errors so

The OP had some errors so read this one, it makes more sense.

________________________________

The title asked the question. Of Course I am not asking has your PAIN and way off life improved I already know the answer to that for most. In detail I mean if taken as prescribed and containing no Tylenol do the medication that we (most) of us are Dependant on to live normally or somewhat, damage our organs or whole body in general. If so does that in turn short our overall lifespan:take years of of my life due to taking the medications. I have always wondered this since my pain had become chronic but have never read a sound answer proving so. This causes me to ponder for hours on occasion.

 

Thanks Kenny




Posts: 71
Joined: 2008-03-26
opioid damage

now im no doctor, im just someone who has a lot of experience taking opiates, as an addict, and a chronic pain sufferer.  like u said, "containing no tylenol"  i think that would be the thing that does you in, not if you take as prescribed, coz if you are on an opioid med with apap in it, your dr should have figured out your dosage and given you the rx for the pill with the right amount of apap so its not harmful.  but if you abuse them, thats where the damage to your liver and stomach and god knows what else would occur.  I was rxed roxi 15s, and as most of us know they have no apap in them.  and i felt better on those then anything with tylenol.  Also i am on a pretty hefty dose of methadone now, and according to the reading material, and the orientations i had to attend at the clinic, (as this is for addiction, not pain)  they say that the methadone doesnt hurt you or affect anything badly.  but again who knows.  I would like to hear Dr Lois' answer to this one.  I just told u what i have been told, and from my personal experience.  Like i said I am no Dr so listen to other peoples replies, esp Dr Lois, and anyone else that may be in healthcare, from  dr to a pharmacist.   But I was shocked when the Doc at my clinic said that the 'done doesnt hurt your body.

 




Posts: 64
Joined: 2007-07-20
I believe that it depends on

I believe that it depends on the type of opiod being discussed. Unfortunately (or fortunately, however you want to look at it) there is no "generic" opiate/oid functional group, such as diazepine in benzo's, to apply to all the substances that fit the description of a narcotic analgesic. There are phenanthrenens ( morphine and codeine), partially-synthetics (ketones of phenanthrenes, etc), morphinans (levorphanol) piperidines, both a-piperidines (the fentanyls) and p-piperidines (meperidine), the open-chain, or diphenylpropylamines (methadone, propoxyphene), etc, etc

Many of these classes of narcotics only have one thing in common: they bind to mu-receptors.

But as far as stimulation of the endogenous opiod system is concerned, I dont believe there are any long-term problems associated with their use, aside from addiction.

However, there may be secondary long-term effects based on a person's response to a certain narcotic. For instance, a person on methadone for many years may gain weight because of the drug-induced lethargy. This could lead to problems later in life.

Or, a long-time oxycodone may have higher stress and anxiety due to the stimulant effects the drug possesses. This may lead to problems later in life.

I have heard of hearing loss with a few different narcotics, but this may be people confusing otic-toxicity of combo narcotics, not pure opiods.

Yet another idea I heard, just yesterday, came from my chemistry prof. We were discussing the ring-structure of benzene, when he pointed out how poisonous the stuff is, and that it has cancer-causing properties. He then offered his theory that since so many consumables that humans use contain benzene (drug-wise, the majority do. ASA,APAP, MS,etc), that their consumption could lead to cancer.

I had never heard this before, so I am taking it with a grain of salt, but, it does seem plausible.




Posts: 71
Joined: 2008-03-26
pizzi..

whats up pizzicato...I will have to say I agree with you about the type of narcotic analgesic, and the problems u mentioned, like addiction...duh, i didnt even think of that in my last reply, and also the weight gain from methadone, which I can vouch for first hand, i think the cause of the weight gain differs in people.  like you are right some people its gonna be from the laziness and being tired and inactive, but it also makes you eat more...plain and simple.  u crave a lot of sweets, and just food in general.  now im a big guy, not fat big just big, and I can eat, but now on the 'done I can eat even more.  So I see your point about problems later on in life, coz lets face it...if u are on methadone for a # of years piggin out, not only will u be heavier, u could clog arteries or whatever the case may be.

  As far as what u said about the oxy and stress and anxiety, I agree also, coz when I was using that stuff, I was happy coz I felt sooo good, but it also makes you very snappy at people and your mood swings very quickly, u get aggravated soo easily and this could lead to heart problems due to stress, among other stress causing illnesses.  Again down the road.   So pizzi good reply,  I definately agree with you.  I was thinking more direct damage from long term use, like your liver going or kidneys etc, I didnt think outside the box.  Hearing loss is one i never heard.   And as for benzene, what exactly is that?   




Posts: 64
Joined: 2007-07-20
I am the same way with the

I am the same way with the oxycodone.  I feel great, painfree, etc, but it is almost like I want to be alone.  I have such a short fuse, for anything.  Be it my girlfriend, the cat playing with its toy, or even my dog staring at me. 

It is the only narcotic I have felt "strung-out" on, and I can only be on it for a few months at a time before swithching to another analgesic, because I start to get weird.  My sleep is affected, which only adds to the poor temperment, and everyday starts to feel like the day after doing psychedelics.  Annoyed, tired, borderline paranoid, while at the same time feeling "good".

I dont know much about the chemical properties of benzene.  All I really know is that it is an organic (carbon-containing) highly flammable liquid, that is added to petroleum products, and is used in other industrial applications.

I am mainly familiar with it's molecular structure, which, if you have every studied chemistry, you would surely recognize it.  It is a cyclohexane (6 sided polygon, cyclo referring to the ring structure).

It has alternating double and single Carbon-Carbon bonds.  So, if you can envision the polygon I am talking about, it is the on with a double bond alternating with a single bond on the inside of the ring structure. If you go to wikipedia, you can see it's structure.  It also has a brief description of it's properties. I would suggest checking it out, and then start typing in various drugs, both OTC and rx, and you will see this ring structure in many of the drugs we commonly ingest.  For instance,morphine, acetaminophen, aspirin, diphenhydramine, all have a benzene ring in their molecular skeleton.

I don't know if the professor's theory is true, or if it is even feasible, but it would be interesting to find out. 

 

 




Posts: 93
Joined: 2007-12-16
For now lets focus on first

For now lets focus on first relating and direct problems that  can be done to your organs and body. So has it ever shown that a certain drug when taken for years maybe even decades to negatively effect an organ or even caused the organ to fail??

 




Posts: 64
Joined: 2007-07-20
As for certain opiods that

As for certain opiods that can cause localized problems to an organ/organ system, I remember hearing that methadone and it's derivatives (levo-acetylmethadol (LAAM) were linked to an increased cardiac QT-interval (this is measured from the start of the Q wave, until the end of the T wave).  Lengthening or shortening the interval can cause arrhythmia, and in this case, a braycardic arrhythmia.  

I think this was the reason for LAAM being withdrawn from the market, although it could have been hepatoxicity, I cant remember.

I am also not sure if this drug reaction is a primary cause-and effect relationship, or if these instances involve a pre-existing cardiac problem being exacerbated by the drug.

I also know that in patients with poor hepatic or renal functioning, certain narcotics, especially prodrugs and those who undergo extensive 1st pass metabolism can further liver/kidney damage, and decrease elimination of the drug from the body, causing accumulation.  This would include codeine (methylmorphine-->demethylation via CYP2D6-->morphine), morphine(CYP3A4), methadone(CYP2D6+CYP3A4), and others.  Although, this could be said for any drug that is heavily metabolized by liver enzymes, and not just narcotics.

For the most part, opiods are a very safe medication, and there are very few direct correlations between prolonged administration and detrimental problems.  For this reason, it is hard to determine whether the instances of problems due to opiod administration are due to the opiod, or because of an underlying problem.

 Good thread though.  You have piqued my interest, and now I am inclined to do a little research.




Posts: 64
Joined: 2007-07-20
I just remembered something

I just remembered something I had read awhile ago.  

I cannot remember where I read this, and I cannot find the article again, so this may have been speculation or statement by a "poor" source, or even a gov't or private org. propaganda statement used as a scare tactic. So unless it can be confirmed by a respectable source, I would not regard this as fact or truth.

Anyway, I read that opiods, specifically oxycodone, have been linked to diabetes.  They claimed that there was a decrease in insulin-dependent sugar regulation with the regular administration of oxycodone.

Again, I cannot find anything about this again, which makes me wonder if I just read this on a message board or a patient information monograph, and not a "professional" document.  It is a claim I had never heard before, and have not heard since, and it seems to me that a claim like this could be explained by an increase in appetite from the drug, and not a specific problem decreasing the efficacy of insulin or similar systems.

Pretty much all CNS depressants can cause an increased appetite, so it would not be uncommon for a CP patient to have elevated blood sugar simply from eating more, or eating poorer quality foods.

The only reason I am posting this is to see if anyone else has heard of this, or if anyone has any sources claiming this problem.  If it is true, it would be interesting to find out about, but at this point I cant say this is fact, since I have nothing to support the statement. 




Posts: 93
Joined: 2007-12-16
Pizz.. Thank a lot for your

Pizz.. Thank a lot for your comments and info! They all add onto and are very interesting at that. The Rumor of Oxycodone linked to cause of diabetes is a bit frightening but very interesting tho it is not confirmed truth or rumor as or yet. Thank you very much for you help :)